And where's the Federal Govt?
Oh yeah,,,,,,,,,They'er on vacation again.
So we go no where, again.

Time and $$$ well spent by CEP?! At least they got to see the Habs on us!

No wonder why the dues for CEP are so high, oh well, another party in March. Ya, I think it's a waste of money sending every president and exec from every mill.

A waste of money sending the Executive there?
Then what do you suggest you genius?
Do you think the problem will go away by just ignoring it?
If you have a 100% successful and cost efficient solution then put it forward and I'm sure the Executive would be more than interested to hear you out.
But if all you can do is whine then I would suggest you concentrate your energies and attentions elsewhere.

March will be the 3rd time they meet with zero progress....must be taking the same course as AbiBlow management on how to spend money wisely! ( that's sarcasm for you douchebags who think all is well)

Nothings well and getting worse by the day. So we start up next week just long enough so we can't bump. Run or end it. One or the other. No way. Pricks up top keep screwing us over.

Then what do you suggest? Oh! I've heard it before. Decertify the Union. Then what?
Go to work for $10 an hour and YOU pay the benefits for the company execs?
Guaranteed you'll be working a long time and that scenario is not too far off from what things were like BEFORE we had a Union.
If you cannot come up with a viable solution at least show your Union a little solidarity.

Hey Woody...the union doesn't exist(in T.Bay)...since the announcement of #5PM starting up...2 lines of progression kraft and paper, can't greive squat, guys working OT to fill shifts while others are layed off, juniors guys working while senior guys not....what more needs to be said?? O yeah the union's favourite excuse..."they (AbiBlow) have the right to manage" ha what a joke! Those bewbs couldn't manage a one car parade! But it's all goood???!
The funny thing is this is just 1 mill (T.Bay) in this crappy corporation...I'm sure all the other Canadian mills are going thru the same crap as we are but we tend to vocalize a little more than others!

Unions are great, but i'll quit before i take a wage decrease, or have to retire at 62. Are you willing to take a wage decrease or work longer to get pension, i bet you are....Maybe if stupid CEP never loaned the pension money to the company we might not be in this bad of shape. When the company comes to the Union to borrow money what would you think, Hey these guys like me, NO they have to much dept and nobody will loan them money. But we're so nice..
To me they're is no bargaining get a 1-2% raise and the mills that are going to die let them. I'm really sorry it might be yours but that's what union brother's would do, right. We've bailed them out and now every employee might not get a pension or even what they put in, if the company goes bankrupt.
Mills shouldn't bargain seperately ever in the same company, but CEP has let this company do it. CEP is weak and they will go down with the company so they'll sell us out anyway, to protect themselves at the top. So give the rest of the mills a chance and see you boys around...

Look at whats running 39 Pulper.
Need I say anymore. That two faced prick has been sitting on the fence far too long. And some one should take a 980 and push him off allready. Because thats what it would take to move his fat ass. He sold us out for his cushy fibre job. Now we are all screwed. Cept the boys in the gas chamber and they can have it. I'm outta there.

Seems like the CEP(National)and the province of Quebec are the only ones who want to save Abitibi. I guess that jobs(dues and taxes) are the reasons.

Members are getting tired of their Union talking out of both sides of their mouth. Their is a moratorium on pensions until 2014 but it's alright for the "pattern setter" to negotiate pensions. They want to increase active members payments, take away the early retirement and deduct another 12% or more from the retirees. And for what ? To save AbiBow's solvency issues in pensions. Give me a break ! Since when did the Union take on the roll of saving the Company from bankruptcy ?Even if the membership was dumb enough to save the pensions with their own money(1.3 Billion), AbiBow would still be over $6 billion in debt !

AbiBow has been in CCAA for a long time now. And for whatever reason, seem to keep getting more extensions. They don't have to pay their bills while going deeper in debt and putting other companys at risk by undercutting. Does anybody know why in Hell the CEP have agreed to let this perverse company be the ones who set the pattern ?

If anybody in this industry wants to survive with their CA's intact and preserve the system of pattern and group bargaining then Abitibi has to die. Stop the madness now ! Pick yourselves another pattern setter(Domtar) and let the creditors decide who runs and who doesn't. The longer you wait, more mills will be giving consessions and pattern bargaining will be gone forever.

NO MORE EXTENSIONS !
NO MORE CONSESSIONS !

You say Solidarity woodroom, didn't your union throught out your mill senority and lay off the guys with the most senority. Ya Solidarity Brother. Looks like you don't have a union because that's what unions protect, your senority. So you broke your contract to protect yourselves. I wonder if your union president is working ahead of other union employees with more senority. Did it save your mill throwing away senority.
CEP has been crap for the last 15 years, went on strike 10 years ago to accept the same contract 6 months later on strike. colaping the union and company, While the big union guys were getting full pay, great job. From what i heard the real union men were in the 70's not 2000's like yourself. Now the pattern bargaining and with the most broke ass company around, these guys are great.
It seems like CEP merged with Abitibibowater a year ago. Well i hope the goverment bails us out cuz if they don't we all screwed anyway...
You're not so talkative now...

Our Union is going through extraordinary times. No conditions such as these have ever existed before so as a result the Union has to proceed through dark territory.
Again I say if you have a viable solution let's hear it.
I know. Shut it all down!
Then the next step is to blame the Union for that!
Either YOU do something or clam up!

well well this pension benefit never add up and never will with less people working and more retirement wind up negotiation in march will not change anything government commitments will take time mistake have being make and will we get to vote on these negotiation I say no way will they let us vote

"ranout":

I just "ran out" of breath trying to read your comment!

Relax and chill out with a "wobbly pop" and spark up a "fat one";you'll feel better!

8-]

He should be passing instead of puffing..

hey see ya looks like you are going to guit and maybe get some pension money @62 if you are still around CEP can not do anything but said OK to abit bow so chill out and have wobbly pop

In March they will probably seek and be granted another extension by the Quebec appointed judge. What a hose job all of this is.

Can't they just announce already who is staying open and who is being closed and let people get on with their lives??? Its been 10 months of legal mumbo jumbo, revolving shut downs, and flat out union busting.

disgruntled---Why would they want to close down any mill right now? They have it pretty sweet if you ask me....they hold jobs and pension over every unions head,scream "we have the right to manage",demand and apply virtually ANYTHING they want regardless of the current contract and we all just throw up our hands and say there is nothing we can do...From a company's standpoint....that's pretty sweet.
Maybe by the time they are all done we'll be back to where the contracts were 25 years ago....I hope we don't loose coffee and lunch breaks...but then again..what can ya do?

compassn.....you are right, what was i thinking?? People like this do what they can get away with, not whats is right. Question is, who is letting them get away with it??

I think you know the answer to your question, disgruntled. If the membership does not stand up at their caucus next month and direct the National to stand down and do the right thing this will go on until nothing is left. Group and pattern bargaining is almost done now.

Compassn is right, Abi is loving this. They don't have to pay their bills and can stand idly by while the pensions go further in debt, the unions get destroyed,the competition gets screwed, and the chiefs keep drawing huge salaries and bonus's while building their nest eggs for the eventual fall.

Lets hope the Local Exec's will represent their members properly at the next caucus meeting. Especially those from other Company's outside of AbiBow. It is not the CEP's responsibility to rescue companys from bankruptcy, especially when it screws their other members. This has been and continues to be all about Quebec. It's time to shut er down brothers and sisters and let the cards fall where they may. If the membership stands by and lets this continue then don't blame the National, thier only doing thier job trying to save members and dues. Blame yourselves for not giving direction, after all the membership is the highest authority in any Union. The last time I looked the CEP was a TRADE UNION.

Pete,,,i cannot diagree with or add to anything you said, Its all a bloody shame though. Quebec mill are among the highest cost lowest producing too.

Sad statement but could very well be true. This comments from TBSource. He may have something here.

Read on.

laidoffmillguy says:
This is good news that 170 people will be going back to work.....but I have heard that abitibibowater's only reason for starting up this mill again was to so that they can keep the 13 sustainable forest licences. Once the licenses are re-secured I have a feeling that the mill will be in jeopardy again. Paper mill's production are in a steep decline and will be for a while due to the digital age and oversea competition. I would like to be wrong on this one but the fact is this mill is not feasable.